Flying Saucers?

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by Cr6 on Sat Apr 14, 2018 3:20 am

This particular finding might be worthy of some experimentation with Lifters/Ionocraft.

The direction of "charge" on graphene can be set...similar to the copper sheeting to quickly focus charge:

http://milesmathis.the-talk.net/t123-mathis-on-graphene-any-hints#2150

(snippet)

Graphene Effectively Filters Electrons According to the Direction of Their Spin

December 26, 2013

New research from MIT shows that graphene can effectively filter electrons according to the direction of their spin, something that cannot be done by any conventional electronic system.

Graphene has become an all-purpose wonder material, spurring armies of researchers to explore new possibilities for this two-dimensional lattice of pure carbon. But new research at MIT has found additional potential for the material by uncovering unexpected features that show up under some extreme conditions — features that could render graphene suitable for exotic uses such as quantum computing.

The research is published this week in the journal Nature, in a paper by professors Pablo Jarillo-Herrero and Ray Ashoori, postdocs Andrea Young and Ben Hunt, graduate student Javier Sanchez-Yamaguchi, and three others. Under an extremely powerful magnetic field and at extremely low temperature, the researchers found, graphene can effectively filter electrons according to the direction of their spin, something that cannot be done by any conventional electronic system.

Under typical conditions, sheets of graphene behave as normal conductors: Apply a voltage, and current flows throughout the two-dimensional flake. If you turn on a magnetic field perpendicular to the graphene flake, however, the behavior changes: Current flows only along the edge, while the bulk remains insulating. Moreover, this current flows only in one direction — clockwise or counterclockwise, depending on the orientation of the magnetic field — in a phenomenon known as the quantum Hall effect.

In the new work, the researchers found that if they applied a second powerful magnetic field — this time in the same plane as the graphene flake — the material’s behavior changes yet again: Electrons can move around the conducting edge in either direction, with electrons that have one kind of spin moving clockwise while those with the opposite spin move counterclockwise.
...

From the Period 4 paper..more points from Miles that need to be remembered. I forgot completely his mentioning the Arsenic-Copper-Iron connection that Nevyn pointed out.

Miles Mathis wrote:I have now fielded a good question from a reader. He asks, “Don't you have charge being affected in opposite ways here? When channeled charge passes through the axis level, you say it interferes with conduction. But then you say it 'boosts' charge in Selenium. Isn't interference the opposite of boosting? How can that work?” It works because Selenium isn't conducting. You get conduction with elements like Arsenic and Copper, which have different numbers of protons top and bottom. Or you can get magnetic conduction with elements like Iron, but then you need more protons in the axis than in the carousel. Neither of those things is true of Selenium. Therefore, when the crossing charge meets the main axis charge in Selenium, it can only boost the charge. Some charge gets captured, you see, which acts like a boost. Remember, the interference I was talking about with conduction is actually a capturing of charge as well. But because it is captured by charge that is being conducted through the axis instead of charge being channeled into the carousel level, it ends up lowering the total instead of increasing it. Just think about it: we add an equal amount of charge to the top and bottom inner holes. So the north charge is increased by the same amount as the south charge. But the south charge was twice as strong as the north to start with (because the south has two protons pulling in charge while the north has one). Therefore, after adding equal amounts to both, the north charge is no longer half the south. It is a tiny bit more than half. Which means when they meet, we now get a tiny bit more cancellation. The north charge is a tiny bit stronger than it was, so it cancels a bit more than half of the south charge, giving us less conduction. But since Selenium isn't conducting, it doesn't feel experience this cancellation. It only experiences the boost. When elements have equal numbers of protons north, south and in the carousel level, the axis charge is pulled into the carousel level from the nuclear center, and so it never crosses.

http://milesmathis.com/per4.pdf

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by LongtimeAirman on Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:02 pm



Cr6, thanks for the help. My atomic understanding needs plenty of work. I’ve just reread the Selenium quote several times. Here’s my takeaway: 1. I believe that when“conduction” is used in this paragraph, it refers primarily to the main N/S charge flow within the atom; 2. Electric conduction occurs when the main N/S charge current through an element is unobstructed and there is an imbalance in the number of top and bottom protons which favors one predominant direction of charge current - such as we would find with Copper; 3. Magnetic conduction occurs when the main N/S charge current is unobstructed and there is an equal number of top and bottom protons - such as we would find with Iron; 4. Obstructed main channel charge flow occurs when protons occupy the hook positions – the locations of the four single protons in the Selenium diagram shown; 5. Charge traffic through the carousal level does not block the main N/S charge current; 6. Atoms capture charge from the field, Selenium hook position cross currents will add some charge to the main N/S charge current. Note. I’m no doubt missing several points and I’d greatly appreciate corrections.

With respect to the Lifter, I believe charge blockage is occurring between atoms sharing charge channels, between the individual air and Lifter atoms. For example, main upward charge channels from the air just below and entering the aluminum are redirected by the 30kV DC energization horizontally to the left or right, or perhaps in or out of the foil.

Cr6 quoted. Under an extremely powerful magnetic field and at extremely low temperature, the researchers found, graphene can effectively filter electrons according to the direction of their spin, something that cannot be done by any conventional electronic system.
I believe this statement completely agrees with our charge field understanding, atoms are either matter or antimatter. Powerful magnetic field at extremely low temperature sounds a bit oxymoronic. It seems researchers are perfectly aware of electron spin and atomic polarity, and are adopting charge field ideas whatever their operating theory happens to be.

Cr6 quoted. Under typical conditions, sheets of graphene behave as normal conductors: Apply a voltage, and current flows throughout the two-dimensional flake. If you turn on a magnetic field perpendicular to the graphene flake, however, the behavior changes: Current flows only along the edge, while the bulk remains insulating. Moreover, this current flows only in one direction — clockwise or counterclockwise, depending on the orientation of the magnetic field — in a phenomenon known as the quantum Hall effect.
That is a perfect example of charge “blockage”, turning the charge thereby adding to the charge’s path length. Under high energetic conditions, with orthogonal magnetic field applied, charge current may be “turned” from vertical to horizontal, along the horizontal edges of the Lifters. A very nice possibility. With the Lifter, there’s no magnetic field. Can Al emit a magnetic field? What kind of current will the 30kV DC generate in the Al?

At this point, I enjoyed and highly recommend the paper, Force on an Asymmetric Capacitor, by Thomas B. Bahder and Chris Fazi, http://jnaudin.free.fr/lifters/arl_fac/index.html, and found at http://jnaudin.free.fr/lifters/main.htm. The paper provides a good background – cleared for release or disposal. It has definitely added to my awareness.  

From the Introduction:
Biefeld-Brown effect, i.e., when a high voltage (~30 kV) is applied to the electrodes of an asymmetric capacitor, a net force is observed on the capacitor. By asymmetric, we mean that the physical dimensions of the two electrodes are different, i.e., one electrode is large and the other small. According to the classical Biefeld-Brown effect.
The Biefeld-Brown Effect is expressed by the paper’s title - Force on an Asymmetric Capacitor.
The paper includes background of the work done by Thomas Townsend Brown. Brown initially believed he had discovered an electromagnetic control of gravity. Brown had many followers, Fran De Aquino comes to mind. A few technical details.
the largest force on the capacitor is in a direction from the negative (larger) electrode toward the positive (smaller) electrode. … In fact, these experiments indicate that there is a force on the capacitor independent of polarity of applied voltage.

And a fine admittance of the lack of a theoretical explanation.
At the present time, there is no accepted detailed theory to explain this effect, and hence the potential of this effect for applications is unknown.

The authors built their own Lifters to verify the veracity of the device, including an aluminum covered Styrofoam lunch box and straws.

I’ll include a few more excerpts from the paper:

Furthermore, the force on the capacitor always appeared in the direction toward the small electrode—independent of the orientation of the capacitor with respect to the plane of the Earth's surface. The significance of this observation is that the force has nothing to do with the gravitational field of the Earth and nothing to do with the electric potential of the Earth's atmosphere. (There are numerous claims on the Internet that asymmetric capacitors are antigravity devices, or devices that demonstrate that there is an interaction of gravity with electric phenomena, called.)

I’m including the following because rather than saying the effect works in a vacuum or not, it would be good to know precisely when these effects are observed in order to, as they state, determine the effect’s possible usefulness in the future.  

As discussed, the most pressing question is whether the Biefeld-Brown effect occurs in vacuum. It seems that Brown may have tested the effect in vacuum, but not reported it (Appendix B). More recently, there is some preliminary work that tested the effect in vacuum, and claimed that there is some small effect—smaller than the force observed in air; see the second report cited in reference [2]. Further work must be done to understand the effect in detail. A set of experiments must be performed in vacuum, and at various gas pressures, to determine the force versus voltage and current. A careful study must be made of the force as a function of gas species and gas pressure. In order to test the thermodynamic theory presented here, the dielectric properties of the gas must be carefully measured. Obtaining such data will be a big step toward developing a theoretical explanation of the effect. On the theoretical side, a microscopic model of the capacitor (for a given geometry) must be constructed, taking into account the complex physics of ionization of air (or other gas) in the presence of high electric fields. Only by understanding the Biefeld-Brown effect in detail can its potential for applications be evaluated.

Sorry for the prior JNL mistake, it should be jln Labs.

I’ll stop there.
.


Last edited by LongtimeAirman on Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:04 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Quote Quote typo correction)

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by Cr6 on Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:26 pm

Thanks for JLN Labs links...brings back a lot!  

Found a few things related.

https://www.upi.com/Science_News/2017/08/30/New-nano-sized-device-can-lift-165-times-its-weight/6331504120731/
...

http://www.gerbertechnology.com/news/first-unmanned-aerial-vehicle-takes-to-the-skies-during-farnborough-2016/


First Unmanned Aerial Vehicle Takes to the Skies during Farnborough 2016


Thursday, July 14, 2016•Categories: Laser Templating
WATERLOO, Ontario, Canada

Virtek Vision International, a market leader in the field of laser-based manufacturing technologies, announced lift off with the first unmanned aerial vehicle! A pioneering research collaboration between the University of Central Lancashire (UCLan) and The University of Manchester’s National Graphene Institute (NGI) will result in the world’s first public flights of Prospero, the first unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) with graphene constructed wings.  

The flights will take place at Farnborough Air Show 2016 July 15-17, 2016 between 2:00 p.m. and 2:30 p.m. GMT.

Carlos Pinto, sales territory manager for Virtek, said, “We are happy to be in partnership with the UCLan’s Engineering Innovation Centre (EIC) and their partners, demonstrating continuous innovation within aerospace using graphene. We are excited to see where this new material will go in benefiting aerospace carriers for future projects using graphene applications. On behalf of all of Virtek, congratulations on the hard work and progress you have made on this project and delivering innovation to aerospace.”

Virtek maintains a strong partnership with UCLan, continuing to innovate together in creating benefits to the manufacturing process in the aviation industry. Virtek Laser Projectors have the ability to guide a beam of laser light onto a work surface or part with a high degree of accuracy, speed and precision for applications such as composite ply layup, paint masking, placement of components or materials, and assists with assembly processes.

Billy Beggs, UCLan’s engineering innovation manager, said, “Graphene has huge potential for aerospace. It is incredibly strong, yet lightweight and flexible at the same time. Through our partnership with the National Graphene Institute at The University of Manchester, and alongside a number of Lancashire-based SMEs, we aim to develop a route map that enables graphene to play a key role in the future development of the aviation industry.”

Visit UCLan at the North West Aerospace Alliance, (NWAA) booth, Hall 1/B140, and visit with Virtek during Farnborough, Canada Area, Ontario Pavilion, Hall 4 E90.

Continue to connect with us @VirtekVision to hear more about “PROSPERO’s” next adventure. Also check out our new website: www.virtek.ca.

Photos accredited and provided by: University of Central Lancashire (UCLAN)

About Virtek
Virtek is the global leader in laser templating and quality inspection systems, providing exceptional expertise and engineering for manufacturers around the world. The Virtek name has become synonymous with precision, reliability, and innovation.
....

https://www.nanowerk.com/nanotechnology-news/newsid=38064.php

Posted: Nov 11, 2014
Graphene-toughened composites for next generation aerospace structures

(Nanowerk News) The School of Engineering at Cardiff University and Haydale have announced new research demonstrating significant improvements in mechanical performance including impact resistance in carbon fibre composites.
These results, particularly the increased damage tolerance, could have significant implications for the development of future composite structures, demonstrating the potential in future aircraft design for weight saving and the consequent environmental benefits such as reductions in CO2 emissions.
The research was undertaken by the Cardiff School of Engineering with additional funding from the European Community’s Seventh Framework programme under the Clean Sky Joint Technology Initiative. The Clean Sky Initiative is one of the largest existing European research programmes with the aim of accelerating technological advancements in aircraft design and green aviation technology. The project was based on requirements specified by the Centro Italiano Richerche Aerospaziale (CIRA) for developing new composite technologies for Green Regional Aircraft (GRA), and was managed by an integrated team from CIRA, Cardiff School of Engineering and Haydale.

....


Researchers unlock the secrets of dragonfly wings

21 August 2017 | Cordelia Sealy
From left to right: The dragonfly B. contaminata. The black rectangles on the wings show the parts of the wings investigated in this study, the nodus. (Top) SEM image of the nodus of the dragonfly. (Middle) Sketch of the nodus. (Bottom) CLSM image of the nodus. The blue color shows the resilin-dominated part.
From left to right: The dragonfly B. contaminata. The black rectangles on the wings show the parts of the wings investigated in this study, the nodus. (Top) SEM image of the nodus of the dragonfly. (Middle) Sketch of the nodus. (Bottom) CLSM image of the nodus. The blue color shows the resilin-dominated part.

Since humans have attempted to fly, we have tried to mimic the flapping action of birds and insects. Scientists have continued to design bioinspired micro-air vehicles (MAVs) with flapping wings, but there is a gap between the proficiency of even the most novel flying machine and the simplest insect. That gap can only be addressed by a better understanding of exactly how insect wings work.

Researchers from Kiel University in Germany and the Islamic Azad University in Iran believe that their approach can unlock the design principles of the wings of one of nature’s most remarkable aeronauts, the dragonfly [Rajabi et al., Acta Biomaterialia (2017), doi: 10.1016/j.actbio.2017.07.034].

“Dragonflies are known for their impressive flight performance,” says Hamed Rajabi of Kiel University. “They exhibit several flight styles and maneuvers of which many other insects are not capable.”

Although scientists have theorized about the origin of dragonflies’ superior flight capabilities, the role of each wing component in facilitating flight has remained elusive. Now Rajabi and coworkers are taking a new approach to untangling the structure-property-function of different wing components using a combination of wide-field fluorescence microscopy, confocal laser scanning microscopy, micro-computed tomography, scanning electron microscopy, numerical analysis and mechanical testing.

“Dragonfly wings are complex biological composite structures,” explains Rajabi. “At first glance, they appear to consist of two main structural components: an ultrathin membrane supported by reinforcing hollow veins. But, in more detail, they are a unique combination of further specialized components.”

https://www.materialstoday.com/biomaterials/news/researchers-unlock-the-secrets-of-dragonfly-wings/

...


Wing Manufacture


Many of today’s airplanes are made of carbon-fibre composite, but putting graphene in the carbon-fibre coating made the plane’s wings stronger.  

It has better impact resistance and is lighter and more drag resistant than a comparable with conventional carbon-fibre wings.  The material’s strength means the wings of the plane would need to be coated with only one layer of graphene-infused carbon fibre rather than four or five layers of the conventional composite.  If you can build a stronger aircraft with less material, it’s lighter, and you’ll fly farther.  In tests, a graphene-enhanced skin on the wings improved impact damage, a standard measurement of potential in-flight damage, by at least 60 percent.

Further advantages of graphene’s relatively high electrical conductivity remain to be tested.  Conductivity protects a plane from lightning strikes, and because carbon fibre has low conductivity, current airplane wings usually include a copper mesh that provides this protection.  In theory, this copper mesh could be eliminated if graphene is used in the wing, making the plane even lighter and more fuel efficient.  Graphene’s conductivity also could be used to electrically de-ice a plane, according to a study released in ACS Applied Materials and Interfaces, thus eliminating the equipment costs associated with today’s chemical de-icing technology.

A thin coating of graphene nanoribbons in epoxy developed at Rice University has proven effective at melting ice on a helicopter blade.  The coating by the Rice lab may be an effective real-time de-icer for aircraft, wind turbines, transmission lines and other surfaces exposed to winter weather, according to a new paper in the American Chemical Society journal ACS Applied Materials and Interfaces.

Further reading:

https://phys.org

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/11/161128084523.htm

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by LongtimeAirman on Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:01 am

.
Hi Cr6, I see you've recently posted some new subject matter. I'm still on the Lifter.

Repeating the end of the final quote of my previous post. From - Force on an Asymmetric Capacitor, by Thomas B. Bahder and Chris Fazi, http://jnaudin.free.fr/lifters/arl_fac/index.html.
On the theoretical side, a microscopic model of the capacitor (for a given geometry) must be constructed, taking into account the complex physics of ionization of air (or other gas) in the presence of high electric fields. Only by understanding the Biefeld-Brown effect in detail can its potential for applications be evaluated.
A challenge! A model must be constructed. Given the charge field, easy, I thought. I had every expectation of using the ideas I’d shared with Cr6; but the first observation from the previous excerpt I’d quoted finally sunk in.
Furthermore, the force on the capacitor always appeared in the direction toward the small electrode—independent of the orientation of the capacitor with respect to the plane of the Earth's surface.
All my thinking up till now has been assuming that the Lifter force has been upward, toward the small electrode, in line with the Earth charge emissions from the Earth directly below. For example, my previous comment, “main upward charge channels from the air just below and entering the aluminum are redirected by the 30kV DC energization horizontally to the left or right, or perhaps in or out of the foil” is wrong. My model needs improvement.
 
Below, I’ve modified the image below to include its source and title.  http://jnaudin.free.fr/lifters/docs/UnconventionalScience.pdf.

Electrostatic Field around Lifter Electrodes. The electrostatic field around – looking down along - two Lifter electrodes are shown. The wire appears as a circle just below the center of the image, about the size of the period at the end of this sentence. The aluminum foil covers the rounded top and one of the two - right or left - sides of the thin white rectangle below the wire. Both the wire and aluminum foil are perpendicular - in or out - to the image. The energized electrostatic field shown is oriented with respect to the electrodes and is the same regardless of the direction of the Earth - up may be in any direction.

The image is a slice, or cross section, and an easy way to compare the asymmetric surface areas (line lengths in this diagram) of the thin wire and a two sided wide strip and a rounded top surface edge of the aluminum foil. The foil electrode is charged at its highest energy level, 30kV DC, the top red color shown on the energy scale on the right edge of the image. The wire is at the bottom of the energy scale shown. The separation distance between the electrodes has been chosen to avoid arcing - a breakdown of the air, where sparks bridge the gap between the electrodes - at the desired operating voltage. Two of the three sides of a Lifter may be thought of as coming together in the white rectangle, with little to no interference at the Lifter’s 60 degree corners. I believe the lines of constant electrostatic strength, the wide lodes to the right and left are an accurate representation of the extent and degree of ionization present in the air around and between the electrodes.

I was wrong to believe the important boundary was the bottom air/foil interface (bottom edge center zero mark). I now believe, as the image nicely conveys, the important boundary is the foil/air interface between the electrodes, including the electrostatic charge strength of the ionized air to the sides of the energized foil. The foil is emitting a very high B-photon emission rate in sufficient quantity to ionize the air to the various energization levels shown. This is a demonstration of charge path lengthening, it appears most charge is emitted far to the sides of the foil instead of directly toward the wire. There is a relative charge vacuum at the wire. The result is a slow net motion of the electrodes in the direction of the small electrode regardless of the direction of the Earth’s emission field.

Yeah, Nay? I'll move on, but I'd prefer your ideas to help make this Lifter idea agreeable to all of us.
.

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by Jared Magneson on Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:48 am

Yeah, it seems like (to me, obviously) that the Lifter would work better if the aluminum foil were draped across horizontally it in terms of catching upward charge from the Earth. Very interesting that this works with the foil vertical. I'm curious to try one myself, maybe compared both designs and see if the flat method works at all, or how well. Combining them might be interesting too, but of course there are electrical current considerations.

Really cool stuff.

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by Cr6 on Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:29 pm

Yeah LTAM, I can definitely see the Lifter force pushing via the Charge field from the electrodes as you state! Nice perspective on that. Like Jared, It makes me want to build one too and then get some pencil leads and create some graphene with scotch tape. geek

http://phys.org/news/2010-12-graphene-pencil-sticky-tape-videos.html

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by LongtimeAirman on Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:27 pm

.
Jared wrote. Yeah, it seems like (to me, obviously) that the Lifter would work better if the aluminum foil were draped across horizontally it in terms of catching upward charge from the Earth.
Thanks for the “Yeah” Jared. Acknowledging what I’d hoped was a legitimate charge field interpretation for the Lifter. However, your words indicate a misunderstanding I’d be remiss to ignore. I don't want you or Cr6 accidentally hurting yourselves. You can re-vote after I describe: 1) the Lifter; 2) the Lifter and the upward charge of the Earth; and 3) the Lifter and a horizontal aluminum foil electrode - in slightly more detail.


J Naudin agrees with the need for a large horizontal electrode orientation in the image above, although I’m not at all sure which way the small electrode lies (360 Degrees?).

With respect to Lifter, the Earth’s emission field holds up the air and creates the ambient background energy level; beyond that, in my charge field estimation, the Earth’s emission field may be disregarded. The Lifter electrodes emit a strong local electrostatic field that overwhelms Earth’s much weaker emissions; I suppose the Lifter reaches a neutral buoyancy in the air. At which time the asymmetric imbalance of the electrodes and direction of charge emitted by the Lifter allow the demonstration of the Biefeld-Brown effect - a force in the direction of the smaller electrode. The Lifter operates within a given Earth emission field. The Lifter is said to exhibit a force toward the smaller electrode regardless of the direction of the Earth. We do not want to catch additional charge from the Earth, all the effective lift is caused by a local asymmetrical high voltage field.

Modifying the Lifter design to rotate the foil electrode from a vertical to a horizontal orientation directly below the wire will lose the Biefeld-Brown effect. Recall in the electrostatic field image that most of the aluminum foil emissions occur perpendicular to the foil – left or right - away from the foil, at the same time increasing distance away from the small wire electrode above. Rotating the foil 90 degrees would point the foil’s majority perpendicular B-photon emissions directly toward the small wire electrode. The resulting direct charge flow would mean that arcing would be a problem. The electrodes would require a greater separation distance. Most importantly, if charge is not turned or blocked, there’s no charge lift.


http://jnaudin.free.fr/lifters/liftercraft/index.htm
JNaudin wrote. I am currently in search of sponsors to finance this project.
J. L. Naudin, T. T. Brown, Fran De Aquino, and apparently Tesla too, all believed that gravity could be controlled electromagnetically. That is a false notion, we cannot control gravity. We may, however, control charge in limited ways.

Thanks for the help.
.

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by Jared Magneson on Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:06 pm

This makes sense to me, from a charge perspective, though I'll of course admit to misunderstanding it in my last comment the and Biefeld-Brown effect. I thought it was the Earth's charge contributing to the lift in a similar (but obviously different) way to a helicopter, only "priming the pump" with the electrical input. I'll study it more so as not to sound like a dumbass on the topic - it's a new one to me.

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by LongtimeAirman on Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:45 pm

.

http://myfavoritecrafts.com/385249-otc-x1-space-crafts.html

Let’s look at a Flying Saucer I was told makes regular runs to the planets. Going back to the prototype, about 1958 designed by Otis Carr. I've assembled some images. If you know a better source, please share.


http://hello-earth.com/otistcarr/otistcarr.html


Circular Foil Spacecraft
Utron Electrical Accumulator
Using Space itself as the catalyst for the
interchangeable forces of electromagnetism and gravity
http://hello-earth.com/otistcarr/interviewotistcarr15november1958part1.html

The hello-earth site has three recorded interviews with Otis Carr. I haven’t heard them, I’m satisfied with the transcriptions.  

/////////////////////////////

Otis Carr – Technical
https://everipedia.org/wiki/otis-carr-technical/
Otis T. Carr has some information in the public domain for anyone who may be technically minded or interested in furthering Carr's research.  As a protégé of Nikola Tesla much of Carr's theory, dynamics and mechanics re gravity / anti-gravity are Tesla-based.



According to Carr:
"Any vehicle accelerated to an axis rotation relative to its attractive inertial mass, immediately becomes activated by free-space-energy and acts as an independent force... We have shown that a charged body, accelerated to an axis rotation relative to this attractive inertial mass, indicates polarity[3] in a given direction.

The dip-needle points, say, up toward the top of the body.  But mount this while rotating body, with its spindle, on another platform and rotate this platform on a spindle, then if the counter-rotation is greater than the inertial forward rotation of the body, a dip-needle on the second platform will point down while the first dip-needle points up, indicating complete relativity of polarity.  When the exact counter-rotation matches the forward rotation the body loses its polarity entirely and immediately becomes activated by free-energy (tensor stresses in space) and acts as an independent force... The above-described assembly of counter-rotating charged masses becomes weightless and will escape the immediate attraction of gravitational forces."



/////////////////////////////

I’ll try to give the OTC-X1 a Charge Field assessment.
.

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by Ciaolo on Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:58 am

Please help, I want to understand but I’m confused... this looks very important.

Carr wrote:"Any vehicle accelerated to an axis rotation relative to its attractive inertial mass,
by vehicle he means this saucer, right? What is the acctractive inertial mass? How can we say if an axis is relative to it?

immediately becomes activated by free-space-energy and acts as an independent force...
The vehicle acts as a force? What does it mean?

We have shown that a charged body, accelerated to an axis rotation relative to this attractive inertial mass, indicates polarity[3] in a given direction.
By indicates polarity he means we can see the effects of a N/S magnet?


The dip-needle points, say, up toward the top of the body.  But mount this while rotating body, with its spindle, on another platform and rotate this platform on a spindle, then if the counter-rotation is greater than the inertial forward rotation of the body, a dip-needle on the second platform will point down while the first dip-needle points up, indicating complete relativity of polarity.  When the exact counter-rotation matches the forward rotation the body loses its polarity entirely and immediately becomes activated by free-energy (tensor stresses in space) and acts as an independent force... The above-described assembly of counter-rotating charged masses becomes weightless and will escape the immediate attraction of gravitational forces."
The platform has to always be in contact with the body for it to be weightless? If not, this effect could have no need for the rotating platform.

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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by LongtimeAirman on Sun Apr 22, 2018 2:40 pm

.
… When the exact counter-rotation matches the forward rotation the body loses its polarity entirely and immediately becomes activated by free-energy (tensor stresses in space) and acts as an independent force... The above-described assembly of counter-rotating charged masses becomes weightless and will escape the immediate attraction of gravitational forces..."
Ciaolo wrote. Please help, I want to understand but I’m confused... this looks very important. The platform has to always be in contact with the body for it to be weightless? If not, this effect could have no need for the rotating platform.
Airman. Ciaolo, I must apologize, I’m in a bit of a quandary myself. Armed with Miles’ papers and charge field perspective, I’m absolutely certain we can understand physical problems better than mainstream. Go ahead, point anywhere and I’ll prove it, just find an interesting subject and we’ll give it go. Real physical details are best, Otis T. Carr’s OTC-X1 turned out to be a scam. I don’t know what, if anything, about it is real.

Here a few of the “facts” I’ve learned are claimed about the operational saucer. It required a blue crystal and was driven by mind control. It travels instantly between planets or wherever you would wish it to go. An advanced technology - Utrons - provide power without wires. The operational vehicles were confiscated by the military. The diagrams I’d provided above were said to have been converted to an amusement park ride in order to make it past a Patent Office ban against flying saucer designs. Otis Carr collected a large sum of money from investors for which he was later convicted.

Another good site for OTC-X1 info, http://www.rexresearch.com/carr/1carr.htm

Interview: "Long John" Nebel (WOR Radio, NY) with Otis Carr, et al. (1959) ---
OTC (Otis T. Carr): "Our system utilizes gravity, electromagnetism, and electromotive force and a relative field to get its functional operation. We use an electrified sender. It's a sensor power core. Now this is what we call an accumulator... It is a storage cell, an accumulation of storage cells which provide an electromotive force in the same manner that any known battery produces and electromotive force...

This [the Utron] is a dimensional product. It was designed with the dimensions of space itself. We say it is truly the geometric form of space, because it is completely round and completely square. It has been proven in scientific laboratories that the very smallest unit of mass matter ever photographed in the electron microscope are square in shape... We have applied this principle into an electrified system, which is the power core of our space vehicle. Now what makes this unique and novel from a battery is the fact that this is a piece of moving machinery that rotates. Our average storage battery is an inanimate object set in an inertial spot and then the electromotive force is conducted by wires from this battery to animate some object.
I'm sorry, I cannot take anything he says seriously. If Otis was a con man he could spout jargon with the best of them. I’d be more than happy to examine something of value here, but I’m not seeing it.

The OTC-X1 is a bust.
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Re: Flying Saucers?

Post by LongtimeAirman on Sun Apr 22, 2018 5:11 pm

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Moving on. With respect to rotation as a velocity orthogonal to the Earth’s emission field, you may recall I mentioned discs. I’m afraid Jared’s interest in a charge field lift theory for helicopters may be way too complicated for me to even begin to figure out - discs are much easier to grasp Very Happy. Can the charge field add to our understanding?

Full disclosure, I love disc. I played Ultimate Frisbee for most days every week for a few years. My specialty was tossing long hang time discs - leading a running target in all kinds of weather. I miss the team. I haven’t watched any sports since ESPN decided not to show a particular Ultimate competition over twenty five years ago.

I grabbed a document describing disc physics from the intertoobs, looks like it could use a charge field review. First I’m posting it in its entirety. Corrections will hopefully follow. With all due respect, please consider,

The Physics of Disc Flight.
Australia Flying Disc Association, Ultimate Australia
https://afda.com/the-physics-of-disc-flight

A flying disc is a little like a cross between a gyroscope and a wing.

A wing works by having the top and bottom sides of different lengths. The air flow moves over the longer surface faster, creating a low pressure region on top of the wing. The higher pressure region underneath the wing tries to move toward the low pressure region, and as a result lifts the wing.

A disc is like a gyroscope in that it uses gyroscopic inertia, the tendency of a gyroscope to keep spinning in the same plane without twisting and turning.

With no spin, a disc is inherently unstable, and with no speed, no lift is generated, so a combination of these factors is needed for a disc to fly. The exact combination varies significantly from disc to disc, since different discs have different "wing" shapes. Combining the wing and the gyroscope also introduces other factors, as the two are not mutually independent.

The most obvious one is a torque on the disc. If the disc is spinning clockwise and moving forward when viewed from the top, then the left side of the disc is moving faster than the right side. There is a corresponding pressure drop over the left side and that side will produce greater lift, and the disc will try to twist clockwise when viewed from behind. As mentioned above, the gyroscopic inertia acts to counter this, and the greater the spin, the higher the inertia.

Spin
There is almost never any reason for not trying to put as much spin as possible on a disc, all other factors being equal. Spin provides stability, so that the disc will continue to fly in the direction it is already flying. A disc that is lacking in spin will tend to "turn over", that is, twist about the axis of flight, and will generally not go as far as one which has more spin. Lack of spin is probably one of the two major problems encountered when trying to throw accurately over any reasonable distance.

One time when too much spin is possible is when throwing some golf discs. Their flight characteristics are such that they have a very narrow window of stability. Too much spin and they can twist one way, and too little spin and they will twist the other. In general, however, too much spin is better countered by other factors in the throw, such as speed and angle of release, rather than by simply spinning the disc less.

Particular discs are termed "overstable", "stable", and "understable" depending on how they to spin and speed. A disc which needs a lot of spin to be stable at a given speed is called "understable", while a disc which needs little spin to be stable at a given speed is called "overstable". "Stable" generally refers to discs which are stable at a wide range of speeds for a given spin.

Most discs can be thrown "understably" or "overstably" by decreasing or increasing the amount of spin put on the disc.

Speed
The speed of a disc is a major (but not the only) factor in determining how far a disc goes and how quickly it gets there. Unlike spin, it is possible to put too much speed on a disc. The stability of a disc changes as it gets faster, and the stable range of the disc is determined both by the shape of the disc and its spin rate. Most discs used for throwing to other people are stable, that is, they fly flat at a range of speeds. Golf discs on the other hand are usually not very stable - they tend to fly flat only for brief periods during their flight. The rest of the time they are banked either one way or the other.

A generally stable disc thrown with too much speed in relation to the spin will act understably. That is, it will turn over. For this reason, hucking the disc requires plenty of spin and speed. Not enough speed results in the throw landing short, while not enough spin results in the throw diving into the ground.

Most inexperienced players find it easier to get more spin on their backhand, and as a result most inexperienced players will huck on their backhand side.

Rotation Angle
The title does a poor job of explaining what this section is about. Apart from amount of spin, the other major factor in lack of accuracy and distance is the difference between the angle of spin of the disc and the angle of the plane of the disc. The disc often wobbles at the start of its flight, and this is the problem. Ideally, the disc should be spinning flat and wobble-free. If the thrower puts spin on the disc at an angle to the flat plane of the disc, it will wobble and lack control.

This is usually most obvious when teaching beginners the air bounce. For an air bounce, the disc is being thrown downwards, and at release the thumb is dragged across the trailing edge of the disc. This results in a slow upward flight. The thrower’s wrist is at a sharp angle to their arm, and beginners often find that getting the arm to move one way while spinning the disc with their wrist in another direction entirely is very difficult.

The end result is a wobbly throw that lacks spin in the right direction, and hence lacks both stability and the ability to get much distance. Similar problems usually result when teaching the high release backhand.

There is often no easy solution. In the case of air bounces and high release backhand the cure is generally practice. The wrist needs time to learn that it can impart spin at a different angle to that of the arm. In the case of normal throws, the thrower may be swinging the disc in a loop instead of straight back and then straight through. The trick may be just to get them moving the disc straight back on the backswing and straight through on the follow through. This is often harder to do than it sounds. Also, it may not be the problem. Plenty of good players use a slightly loopy backswing, but they are able to get their wrist and arm in the right line just before release, usually just through practice.

Attitude (Pitch)
Here we are borrowing a term from aviation to describe one of the angles of release. Pitch refers to how steeply an aircraft is pointed, rotating about an axis through the wings. For a disc, it refers to the angle of release where the front edge of the disc is pointed up or down. Basically the pitch helps determine how far the disc travels, and more importantly, along which path. By keeping the front edge well up the disc will travel well into the air, but will probably stall and float down at the end of the flight. Keeping the front edge down results in a low trajectory, relatively fast flight.

Roll (Bank)
Roll, or bank, refers to the angle of the disc rotated about the direction of travel. This means whether the outside edge of the disc is held up or down. The amount of bank on the disc mainly determines the flight path, and can be used to good effect to throw around players who are between thrower and target. The disc will curve in the direction of the lowest edge of the disc.

Wind
Wind can have a marked effect on all of the five factors mentioned above, depending mostly on which direction it is coming from. An important point to remember is that regardless of how much wind there appears to be, there is no wind at ground level, and there is less wind the closet to the ground you are. This means that to avoid the effects of the wind as much as possible it is a good idea to release and keep throws as close to the ground as practicable.

A headwind increases the apparent air speed of the disc. This means that the amount of spin necessary to keep it stable becomes greater. A headwind also reduces the distance possible, and lifts under discs that are pitched with the leading edge up, sending them into the air.

A tailwind conversely decreases the air speed of the disc, but can increase ground speed. While distance may increase there is a drop in lift, which means that the disc needs to be thrown at a higher angle of attack to counteract the wind that tends to push the disc into the ground.

Crosswinds have the most effect on banked discs, either by pushing the raised edge up and lifting the disc, or by pushing down on a lowered edge and possibly making the disc dive into the ground. Crosswinds also make it difficult to keep the disc flat on release, and even experienced players may find it difficult to keep the angle of spin in the plane of the disc.
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Re: Flying Saucers?

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